Hard meme

[liv]

j4 came up with a challenging meme. I normally refuse on principle to spread memes that have blackmail attached to them, but hers is such a great idea that I wanted to do it anyway.

It's surprisingly hard, though! I came up with ten people I could talk to without using LJ. But not all of them are on my friendslist, and I don't have something specific to say to them in every case, a lot of them I just wanted to chat about stuff in general. I think making a post saying, who would like some non-LJ communication with me? is cheating, because that blatantly breaks the without the aid of LiveJournal rule!

Of course, the fact that it's tough is making me even more determined to do it, but it's hard. I think this demonstrates j4's implied point that we're all lazy about real socializing due to LJ making things too convenient!

Comments

Re: Hard meme

[pir-anha.livejournal.com]

huh. i am not lazy about "real" socializing due to LJ making things too convenient (it is damn INconvenient for anything that matters, in fact). but this is clearly written by somebody who's not jacked fundamentally into online communications. my LJ f-list isn't filled with people i know in meatspace (only ~25% have i even met, only 1 out of 170 is local to me); it's been born from online connections. most people i know in meatspace don't have LJs, and if i want to talk to them i've got to use the phone or face-to-face, or possibly email. finally almost everyone at least has email; that is what's making it truly convenient, not LJ.

i just don't LIKE "real" socializing much. i prefer to do it online (but not on LJ because LJ is too superficial). i do mine primarily in email and on some forums and occasionally still on usenet. it doesn't feel weird at all to do it off-LJ; if anything, LJ feels weirder.

real socializing

[liv]

I don't think the important distinction here is between in person socializing and online socializing. The distinction is between the kind of superficial feeling of being in touch that I at least can get from reading people's journals and occasionally, when I get my act together, even commenting on them, and real socializing, where I actually interact with the person and have a conversation and listen to them actively.

That can absolutely happen by email or IM, (or phone which seems to be conceptualized somewhere between "online" and "meatspace"). Forums and Usenet don't work for me in the same way that LJ doesn't work for me; I can use those for superficial connections but not for developing or nurturing a relationship.

Re: real socializing

[pir-anha.livejournal.com]

that may be the important distinction for you, but the meme specified to pick 10 people "that you want to say something to". that's not saying anything about real communication, and it does in fact sound rather superficial to me (in the context of a meme without further detail on what the "something" consists of).

i "say something" to people everyday; when i walk to the mailbox i might talk to 4 or 5 people on the way. none of that is real socializing for me; it's all superficial (though it does provide social "oil") -- i'll admire a kid's new bike trick, i'll ask the landlord about the firewood delivery, i'll offer his wife some mulch, i'll chat about a new chinese restaurant with the old guy who looks and walks like his dog...

i can use usenet and forums to develop and nurture relationships with groups, and most of my individual relationships start out in such groups. in fact now that i am hardly on usenet at all, i've made no new friends; it just doesn't seem to happen for me on LJ (which argues very strongly for me to ditch LJ and return to usenet or find some place like it). i get to know people better when we're having vigorous discussions about anything and everything under the sun; the more me-me-me nature of LJ, while it might be more directly personal, just doesn't provide ... something ... important for me. it might be _too_ personal. it certainly doesn't invite vigorous discussion, and anything nearing criticism is decidedly unwanted. and somehow that loses something important for getting to know people.

you're one of a small handful of people who feel like they might become friends if there were a bit more of a connection, because you discuss things in the same open-minded spirit that usenet had for me, and i feel the longer i am reading your LJ the better i get to know you, and what i am getting to know is interesting. but that is astoundingly rare for me, and it takes much more effort than it ever did on usenet.