makeup

[liv]

I had a seriously awesome weekend, with good food and good company. I sat in the sunshine with jack drinking berry smoothies from some random middle eastern café. We had a great time at khalinche and timeplease's housewarming, along with such wonderful people as shreena, kerrypolka and jacquic, eating barbecued veg kebabs and cake and drinking stunningly tasty Madagascan rum. We stayed over chez doseybat and enjoyed a tasty brunch including Lithuanian rye bread and plenty of tea with her and pplfichi. We ate the classiest Indian meal I've ever had at Trishna with fishpi and his partner R. We saw the Hajj exhibition at the British Museum, and then met up with hadassah and angelofthenorth for Afternoon Tea (and wedding ceremony plotting) in the amazingly swanky surroundings of the conservatory at the Chesterfield, Mayfair. It was after all that loveliness, though, that I ran into some drama.

hadassah has been leaning on me to wear makeup for the wedding, in order to match the formality of a silk dress. So she and angelofthenorth decided to take me to Selfridges for a makeover. You were supposed to book in advance, but hadassah somehow managed to talk them into fitting me in. She has the most amazing ability to get what she wants while remaining impeccably polite and friendly - certainly a useful rabbinic skill!

The makeup artist was completely lovely. She was fully respectful of the fact that I don't wear makeup normally, super-patient at explaining what she was doing and giving me options while providing me with enough guidance that I could reasonably choose. Between us we decided to go for big intense eyes but understated lips. I would never have gone in this direction on my own, but looking at my colouring and knowing that the dress is a deep jewel green, we ended up with a mix of brown and sparkly turquoise eyeshadow. Dark brown mascara, foundation almost perfectly matched to my actual skin tone, and blusher and lipstick just a tiny fraction more pink than my cheeks and lips are anyway. It came out surprisingly well, so that I looked like me only more intense and tending just a bit towards glamourous. If I were going to wear makeup, that's the effect I'd want to achieve.

Unfortunately something in this process set off a complete meltdown. All the metaphors I can think of to try to convey how I felt seem ridiculously extreme. Something very distantly related to dysphoria, I think, though I'm embarrassed to even think of such a comparison, but something about looking in the mirror and seeing this pretty, feminine face looking back at me just made me feel completely, unbearably wrong. Or perhaps like a Scene gone wrong; one minute my friends were joshing and teasing and I was playing up my reluctance by pouting and cringing as they were pushing me into doing something I found unpleasant but with my best interests at heart, and the next minute I was genuinely scared and upset and tearful. Only they kept on pushing me and teasing me, as I wasn't really in a position to negotiate or assert my boundaries or, so to speak, call a safeword, because I was supposed to be having fun with my friends, not doing something scary that needed me to be carefully handled with the assurance that I could stop at any time.

When I was in the middle of trying not to embarrass the makeup artist or appear ungrateful to friends who were giving me a lovely present, I found myself buying about £100 worth of fancy makeup, when really what I wanted was to hide in a dark place and cry. And the whole process had taken somewhat longer than we'd planned so we ended up not really having time for dinner, but grabbed fast food from the Café Rouge at Euston before angelofthenorth and I had to dash off to catch trains. angelofthenorth called to check in with me as we were being carried homewards in opposite directions, and was incredibly supportive and sympathetic and helped me start to talk through why I was so upset.

I think she's right, the makeup thing touched off just about everything I'm anxious about at the moment. The practicalities of the wedding, and whether I'm sufficiently organized and in control to make things run smoothly. The conflicting pressures about how a wedding is supposed to be and what it means. There's something in there about the fact that I want to have a pick-n-mix wedding that feels tied up to the fact that I want to have a pick-n-mix marriage. From a purely style perspective, hadassah is absolutely right that if I wear an elegant silk dress, I really ought to wear fancy shoes and an elaborate hairstyle and jewellery and makeup, but in my mind I really want to have just the dress without needing to femme up in that way. Just as I want legal recognition of what I hope will be a lifelong relationship with jack, but I don't want to "match" that by fitting into the feminine stereotype that would require me to sell my independence and my fertility for a diamond ring. Yeah, stuff about gender and self-image, but also the problem I have accepting the fact that I'm really quite clumsy and bad at physical / artistic skills. Even some professional anxiety, because as angelofthenorth pointed out, I am in fact getting to the stage in my career where I have to project an image for public consumption, and for a woman, particularly as I'm approaching middle-age, that probably does mean makeup and other feminine styling.

Anyway, I got home, and carefully removed the face paint using some alcohol wipes that angelofthenorth had thoughtfully bought for me. As soon as I stopped having to worry about ruining the makeup artist's beautiful work, I broke down and cried my eyes out. Proper gasping sobs, unstoppable, like an over-stimulated six-year-old. And thinking about the fact that the source of the upset was my friends being incredibly kind and generous to me just made me cry even more.

I mean, good heavens, I know it's ok to be upset when other people have worse problems, but it's hard to imagine less problematic problems than mine. I'm about to get married to a man I love, I have dear friends supporting me and helping me, I'm even tolerably pretty, enough to turn heads when I can be bothered to make the effort. And I'm in a financial position that accidentally spending £100 I didn't budget for is a mere nuisance, without any real consequences beyond irritation. Also, the sunshine reflecting off the cherry blossom is too bright and it's dazzling my eyes, woe is me!

Following on from all that, I now have to make a decision about whether I'm actually going to go ahead and wear makeup when I get married in a few weeks. It is true that wearing makeup will make me look better and set off my dress properly, and the look that the artist designed at the weekend works really well. I could practice putting on the makeup I've bought until I can do it to my satisfaction, which is a life-skill I've been meaning to acquire anyway, and perhaps if I try it out a few times, I'll get used to it and stop freaking out. My lovely friends have even offered to come and help me get ready in the morning, so I won't have to rely completely on my own very limited skills. But I am genuinely afraid that putting on makeup will make me feel so jittery and uncomfortable that I won't be able to relax and enjoy the wedding.

Plus there's a whole bunch of little things, which are perhaps just excuses because I don't want to do it, but: it's a morning wedding, it will be very stressful to have to spend a long time getting ready in the morning. I'm afraid the makeup will run and smudge over the course of a long and quite possibly hot day, and that'll look far worse than not doing it at all. I'm afraid that even with help from more expert friends, we won't manage to achieve anything that looks even close to as nice or as relatively subtle as what I came away with the other day, and I'll just look like an incompetent teenager failing to look sophisticated and ending up with clownish. I'm afraid of getting makeup on my awesome dress and never being able to get the stain out, or even if I don't, I'll be self-conscious about the possibility all day. I think Mum will almost certainly disapprove of my wearing makeup, since she never has.

Although I'm trying to avoid the sunk cost fallacy, I feel bad about having spent so much money without properly thinking it through. If I definitely decide I'm never going to wear it, I can sell or give away some unopened, really quite good quality Mac stuff. I am a complete babe in the woods about makeup; I don't at all know what is worth spending to get decent quality stuff and what is just mark-up for a famous name, the sort of thing I hugely disapprove of. And since makeup doesn't keep indefinitely, if I am going to get into wearing makeup, I am sort of committing myself to wearing makeup fairly regularly, not just on really rare, exceptional occasions, and I don't know if I can deal with that.

So, what do you think? Should I stand up for myself, donate the makeup to charity or a friend who'll actually use it, and get married wearing my own natural face? I'd risk quarrelling with hadassah over it, and my appearance probably would be blotchy and washed out, and the dress would look wrong without the rest of an outfit at the same level. Or should I spend the next few weeks practising and getting used to makeup, and take up the kind offer to help me get ready on the morning of the wedding, so that I'm a beautiful bride and so I'm not rejecting my friends' generosity?

A couple of things I'm not really looking for here: one is feminist solidarity and affirmations of my right not to wear makeup if I choose not. I know I have that right, and I'm deeply grateful to previous generations for all the fighting they had to do for makeup to stop being compulsory. The question is not whether I have the right not to wear makeup, but whether wearing or eschewing is actually a better idea. I do completely accept that there are some occasions when makeup is a good choice; I'd wear it without protest on stage or if I were appearing on TV, for example, and I have to admit that a highly formal occasion when I'm wearing a beautiful silk dress is a situation that definitely favours makeup over bare face in general. The other is to be assured that it's my wedding so I can do what I like. Superficially, yes, I can, but I actually don't want to. One of the aspects of wedding expectations that I kind of reject is the view that it's about being a princess for day. I actually do care about what will be comfortable and enjoyable for my friends, it's a public event, not just an excuse for me to behave like a spoiled brat.

Comments

[jack]

*hugs* I didn't realise it was quite so intense :( I definitely want to avoid any risk of either of us feeling like that at the ceremony, and am feeling more anti -- certainly I think we should only do it if you've had the chance to try it a few times before and feel comfortable and non-stressed on those occasions (and not at all if you don't feel comfortable with that).

[liv]

I think the reasons why I had such a strong reaction are not directly connected to the makeup itself. I don't know if I would freak out that much again just from putting on makeup for the wedding, but I agree that it's quite a big risk that if I do the whole day will be messed up.

[kass]

For what it's worth: I do not generally wear make-up. I did wear it at my wedding, for the reasons hadassah seems to be suggesting: I was wearing a beautiful, quite fancy, Irish linen dress edged with lace, and I wanted my face and hair to be at the same level of fancy. We hired a make-up artist to do my face on the day of the wedding (and she practiced with me once or twice beforehand, and understood that generally I wear no makeup at all and don't bother with my hair in the slightest, so she knew she needed to have a fairly light hand in making me up.) I don't think there's any disjunction between not wearing make-up most of the time, and choosing to wear it when one is wearing a particularly special dress on a particularly fancy day.

So my suggestion would be to consider hiring a make-up artist to do your face for you on the wedding day. That way, you don't have to worry about whether you'll do it "well enough." (I realize it's an added expense, but if buying all of the make-up was bearable for you financially, this might be, too.) And perhaps it makes sense to also play around with it a bit before then, so that the weirdness of being quite so femmed-up diminishes or maybe even goes away. It's a costume; it's gender play. But it can also look very lovely, and I find that being someone who doesn't wear it most of the time means that when I do choose to wear it -- once a year, maybe twice -- I can feel all the more dressed-up and fancy, and I can enjoy that, and then I can enjoy returning to my usual jeans and boots look thereafter.

One way or another, I think a bit of playing around with the makeup in advance is a good idea, if only because that might help diminish the sense that you've been thrust into a scene without a safeword. Put some makeup on, as sloppily as you need to, and then remove it right away! Give yourself a deeper awareness that you're in control. Might help; couldn't hurt.

[liv]

Thank you for this. It does sound like your situation was very comparable to mine. I definitely find it comforting to think of makeup as being part of a costume. (I'm also quite heartened to know that you can get away with jeans and boots and no makeup in your professional life; your job is even more public facing and probably more male-dominated than mine.)

Hiring a makeup artist would take away my anxiety about being clumsy and incompetent, but it does lead to more hassle on the morning of the wedding, which I do somewhat want to avoid. I suppose that knowing I have that option does make it less scary though.

[jack]

FWIW, I think the immediate practical questions I don't know the answer to are:

- if Liv decides she doesn't want to keep the makeup, would anyone else like it?
- or is there anywhere worthwhile to give it away?
- if Liv would like to keep at least some of it, not for the wedding, but to try out on some professional occasions, how long is it likely to keep for? If she does a posh professional thing a few times a year, will she get at least a few uses out of it, or is it not worth keeping?

[emma]

In terms of how long it will last, it depends on what kind of make up it is. I tend to have a fairly lax view on how long things last, and if it still "works" then it's fine to keep. Things like eyeshadows will last for years, no problem at all. I don't really buy into the idea that you should throw things out after X amount of time just because it's reached some imaginary "expiry date". Make up doesn't really expire! Things like nail varnish can go quite gloopy after being kept for years, but there's no *problem* keeping them for a long time if they otherwise seem to work. Things around the eyes you have to be somewhat careful with because they can harbour infections and then potentially re-infect yourself, if you happen to use them while you have an infection (but then again, how often do people even get eye infections anyway? I know it's an extremely rare thing for me. I suppose similar things could apply to lip products). Liquid foundations and concealers can go "off" a bit faster than other things if the ingredients separate out, but even then giving them a bit of a shake often sorts it out. So, I think if Liv would like to keep some of it for even rare occasions, it won't be any sort of waste!

In terms of whether anyone would like it if she does choose to give it away... well, I don't own any Mac make up and know it is prized for quality in general, so I'm tempted to say yes... However I have no interest in brown mascara or in foundation not matched to my own skin colour... some of the other bits and pieces could be tempting depending on what they are.

Liv, my advice to you would probably be much the same as that given by a few people already... to play around with it a bit and see how you feel, maybe just trying one bit of it at a time so it's not such an overwhelming "transformation". Perhaps just put on a bit of blusher and walk around the house for a bit with slightly pinker cheeks, maybe go to the shops or something if that feels okay... or perhaps with a bit of mascara on, see how you feel with slightly darker and more obvious eyelashes. If the constituent parts seem okay, try combining them. If you find that you feel most comfortable with a bit of foundation on to even out your skin a bit for perhaps photos, then just go with that! And it might wear off a bit throughout the day... you can always put a bit more on, with help from friends if you like. If your friends are willing to help you get ready in the morning then I'm sure they'd be happy for you to whisk them away for 10 mins during the day itself to re-apply something! And if something smudges then you can often quickly fix it with a cotton bud, perhaps dipped into water or liquid make up remover.

Since there's part of you that would like to wear it for this occasion and potentially others, it seems like an ideal opportunity to try it... you already have some make up now, and you know that theoretically it can be used to create a fairly subtle and understated look which enhances your appearance. You've already overcome the barrier of not knowing what to get, or what sort of things you should be doing with it, because you've seen a make up artist use these items to create a personalised look on you, and you know that it objectively looks good (setting aside for the moment the emotions it stirred up). If you try things out and are still not comfortable with it then I say sod it; don't wear any make up. You feeling happy and comfortable is more important than what you look like, even if it may involve some difficult conversations with friends!

[emperor]

I am inclined to suggest trying the makeup thing for a few evenings / times when you can put it on without time pressure. That'll maybe help you get used to how you look with it on, and give you a better feeling about whether it's something you'll be OK with on the wedding day?

[liv]

That almost certainly is the best plan, yes. That probably means I need to acquire makeup brushes, but I reckon I can get away with cheap ones from Superdrug or something, so that shouldn't be a big barrier.

[naath]

I think that given your reaction as you describe it here that wearing makeup, or at least wearing that much makeup (you can wear less and look more like "you" in the mirror maybe?) that wearing it for your wedding is not a good thing for you - it is meant to be a happy day for you and doing something that caused you that much upset just trying it out doesn't seem like a happy thing to me.

I do agree that weddings are also a public thing, not just your very special day where you can do exactly whatever you please (there are lots of things you certainly shouldn't do) - but you not wearing makeup is not a thing which will discomfort your friends or cause a lack of enjoyment (if wearing makeup would discomfort your mother then that seems an argument in favour of not wearing it from this perspective).

[liv]

I'm not sure whether more makeup or less makeup would help, actually. I mean, if I wear loads of makeup, then it's clearly a costume / drag thing, and it seems to justify the effort of having to figure out how to do makeup and all the associated stress. If I wear minimal makeup, so that I look more natural and like my everyday self, then what's the point of putting myself through all this angst? A lot of my problem the other day was that I'm kind of unconvinced by foundation and blusher; I know intellectually they're basically for the camera, but it's hard not to feel that I went to all this effort, and made my face feel and smell weird, without really changing my appearance noticeably at all.

The main pro makeup argument is that I'm wearing a really intense dress, so my face needs to be similarly striking. But if it's just a touch of mascara and some natural coloured lipstick and a tiny bit of foundation to smooth out my colouring, then I'm not going to achieve my goal of not being completely drowned out by the dress. I actually liked the startling brown and sparkly turquoise couldn't possibly be natural eyeshadow; I was much more bothered by the mask-like effect of the foundation.

And yes, you're right, few people will actually care one way or another whether I wear makeup. The not wanting to be princessy comment is more about how I negotiate with the people who have expressed opinions. Conventional wisdom says I'm entitled to say to, say, hadassah, oh, who cares what you think, it's my wedding, I'll do whatever I like! (I suspect that's the advice I would have got if I'd posted this to theladiesloos, for example.) But I don't think I should in fact behave like that.

[jack]

I wasn't really in a position to ... so to speak, call a safeword

I think that's a very apt description. FWIW, I have sometimes felt completely melted down and dumped the social situation onto you for ten minutes, and if you think it would help to (just occasionally) be able to turn to me and say you don't feel up to speaking and can I sort this out, then it's totally fine -- almost all of the time, I won't be feeling stressed at the same time as you, so it's absolutely no difficulty to go decide what to buy or whatever. But I'm sorry, I know that doesn't really help, especially retroactively :) *HUGS*

[liv]

Thankyou, no, this is really really helpful. I didn't in fact realize I could just dump the interacting with other people stuff onto you while I sort my head out. And it's really comforting to know that I can, even though I'm usually the one who's totally fine and relaxed in most social situations. We should at some point, possibly when we're not stressed by wedding planning, talk out further how we make this escape button work. I think it would be really good to be able to support eachother in that way.

[jenett]

I am someone who almost never wears makeup, but who grew up with a father who was a theatre professor and director - so I learned how to put it on in the context of stage makeup.

I don't know if this will help you, but the way I approach it for things like job interviews and other occasions where at least some is something that many people consider appropriate is partly about the "does this fit the setting" but also partly about using it as a tool to bring out what I really want.

So, for example, for job interviews, I'd use mascara with a carefully chosen color to bring out the color of my eyes and attract attention there, maybe concealer if I needed it, and a lip gloss that just slightly darkened (but more or less matched) my natural color for evenness. But not anything I'd need to fuss with (especially since academic library type job things tend to be full day interviews.)

For an unusual fancy occasion, I'd go a little more with that (eye shadow, maybe eye liner, actual lipstick, maybe actual foundation powder) but I'd do it with an eye of what would look good under the lighting where I'd be, what would help people take the kind of photographs I'd really like to look at later, etc. But even there, I tend to stick to colors that enhance my natural features, rather than, say, vividly colored eye shadow. (I totally get why some people find it awesome, but just not me.)

On what to do with what you have: if it's unopened, there are certainly sites online in the US (and I assume in the UK) where you could sell off the bits you might not want to keep. But you might consider using some of it, the bits you do feel more comfortable with , as a compromise. Or, as suggested, playing around with it over a few days, and seeing what you like.

[liv]

Thank you so much for this comment. I really appreciate the way you talk about dressing up for occasions, your theatre background and your general thinkiness about what it all means and what can be achieved practically in terms of image is something that's really helpful and informative to me. I think I could do well to get used to that level of using makeup as a tool for job interviews and very public lectures (eg at big conferences). And yeah, figuring out what is achievable when I'm relatively stressed and short of time (which is nearly always going to be the case when I'm on display professionally anyway!)

Fancy occasion stuff, I agree that the goal is to look good in the lighting and in the photos, but I don't know how to achieve that really. Hopefully I can use the suggestions from the makeup artist who worked with me last week. I am quite bad at picking colours anyway, not just makeup but clothes too; I'm gradually figuring it out, but it's never going to be my strong suit. This is part of the reason why I brought hadassah in in the first place, she has a really good sense of colour and style, so it's great to have the benefit of her expertise.

In general I do the stereotypical female geek thing of not caring about clothes at all most of the time, but going really overboard when I do have an occasion for it. I'm the sort of person who'll wear full evening dress to a houseparty or a wild OTT prom dress to the gala at a con. And there's no in principle reason why I couldn't do similar with the makeup: go completely wild with vivid colours and unmissable effects when I want to, but no makeup at all for everyday.

[rho]

On the very last point, I'd point out that were you to be considerably distressed on your wedding day, that would almost certainly upset your friends as well. I can't imagine I'd be happy at a wedding where the bride was clearly uncomfortable and upset.

I think that the situation here is that you have a potential for either a small gain (looking somewhat better at the wedding) or a large loss (having a breakdown over it). I guess that from an analytical and logical perspective, you'd want to try to assign relative weights to the plus and the minus, and then also try to estimate the any probabilities involved.

To my mind, the potential downside is too large and has too high a probability to risk it for the sake of a relatively minor positive point. Of course, your mileage may vary based on your weighting and your estimate of probabilities.

[rysmiel]

That is pretty much exactly my reaction too, for what that may be worth. It's not a day I see any obligation for you to do anything avoidable that might make you less comfortable.

[princess]

Yes your wedding is not entirely about you (no matter how much I may wish otherwise in regards to my own), but you felt strongly enough to compare this to a situation in which you would safeword. That, to me, is not a discomfort you need to put yourself through on your wedding day for ANYONE else.

[liv]

Thank you for the support! I think the safeword thing probably implies that I'm bad at picking metaphors, rather than indicating the level of direness of the situation. And it wasn't the makeup itself that was the problem, it was the fact that my friends were teasing me and pushing me into something I didn't want to do, but with my cooperation, and when something flipped and I started saying, no, please stop this, you're scaring me! they didn't get that this was different from me playfully hiding my face in my hands and saying, nooooo, scary, don't wanna! If I make a positive decision that I do want to wear makeup for the wedding, I'm pretty sure I won't feel scared and trapped in the same way.

[azurelunatic]

Mascara and liquid face goo are the things that go off first; mascara gets eyelash germs in it and should be discarded after a couple months. Those two are the sort of things where if they are to be passed on, there should be care taken to not contaminate the bottle (hard enough with face goo, and well-nigh impossible with mascara).

I tend to wear makeup to job interviews even when I'm not wearing makeup regularly in any given week, because that's another occasion that is high-formality/high visibility, although less special-format like tv (lights! cameras!) and stage (distance! lights!).


Shoes -- the thought of the logistics of obtaining and wearing fancy feminine and impractical shoes -- reliably sets off gender and body dysphoria for me. So I am not surprised that makeup does similar for you, nor that you've found those terms to describe it, even if normally you haven't many problems like that.

Regardless of whether the look of a made-up face would be more appropriate for a wedding, terror and anguish at gender roles and being treated as chattel are showstopper emotions. I would not be comfortable as a guest at a wedding where I knew or suspected either of the parties to be experiencing that sort of terror and anguish. I expect a certain amount of "oh my goodness this is a big step are we ready" fear, and stage fright, but the emotions you have described are the sort that in my opinion need sorted out beforehand and carefully, not during.


In the practicality of wearing makeup at a busy and fancy occasion logistics -- if the makeup starts melting and running, this is a good time for a bathroom break with the makeup remover wipes which are either tucked into a convenient corner of a pocket, or are in the custody of the helpful party who is acting as personal assistant. After removing the melted mess, it's then your choice whether to put on the stripped-down version, or leave your face bare for the balance of the party.

[liv]

Thank you thank you thank you, I think you really get why I'm so upset, which makes me feel a lot less ridiculous for freaking out this much over such a little thing. And thank you very much for the practical advice about hygiene and how deal with makeup degrading over the course of the day.

In some ways this is an occasion where makeup would be appropriate in general; it's formal, and fancy, and the actual ceremony is going to take place on stage with quite a large congregation, so there are good practical as well as social arguments in favour of makeup. But yeah, you're right, there's a ton of gender anxiety there, and it's probably not a good idea to be dealing with that in the middle of a public occasion.

[rmc28]

I did not wear make up for my wedding, even though I had a very OTT wedding dress[1]. The way I put it to people who asked was that I never wear makeup normally and I wanted to look like myself on my wedding day.

I have not ever had a 'makeover session' or messed around with makeup so I don't know for sure that I would react in a similar way, but it feels entirely plausible. (Oh, actually, I've had tv makeup for the infamous University Challenge episode, and stage makeup a couple of times. I didn't much like the tv makeup; stage makeup is different because you're trying to be someone else anyway.)

As I get older / more senior / try to project a more professional image I am explicitly rejecting makeup, at least for now: my position being that when a man doing the same job has to wear makeup to be taken seriously, that's when I will do so. (At some point vanity may cause me to eat my words, so you can point and laugh if/when that happens.)

All that said, you have some lovely makeup and you have an idea of what to aim for, and you have some time between now and the wedding. You don't have to decide right now what to do about makeup on the wedding day. I think some less pressured playing-around with your new stuff might help you work out the answer to some of your worries, and might even be fun. Like cooking with really nice ingredients. On the other hand, if merely getting the stuff out makes you jittery and upset, then you have an answer there too.

It's not just "your wedding, do what you like". I think it's meant to be a happy day for you and Jack; part of the delight in attending weddings is seeing one's friends/family being happy and celebratory, and if they are stressed or worried, that takes the edge off the shared delight.

So "do what will make you and your beloved happiest". Really.

[1] see http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~rmc28/wedding/photos/official/album/slides/02.rachel%20and%20tony%20outside.html

[liv]

I really appreciate this comment, thank you. And I do definitely admire you for sticking up for your principles both at your wedding and at work. I'd really like to be brave enough to say, well, men don't have to wear makeup in senior or public-facing jobs, so why should I? But I'm not, really, I don't have quite the confidence that I can always pull off achieving more for less recognition than a male or more conventionally feminine colleague. I don't feel that I'm so awesome at what I do that I'll be able to have the career I want even if I disadvantage myself by breaking convention. Of course I feel guilty about this anyway, because all I'm doing is adding to the expectation that professional women have to wear makeup.

For the wedding it's a different story. I'm not contemplating makeup because there's a social expectation that brides should be made up. I do sincerely accept the argument that it will work better with my outfit and probably for photos. It may be that it's not enough of a difference to be worth the angst, but I also don't want to reject the option out of hand.

I think playing around with the makeup, getting used to it, seeing if I can achieve a decent look in spite of my lack of experience and my general clumsiness, is almost certainly a good idea. But it is exactly like cooking with really nice ingredients: I'm nervous about wasting the expensive stuff just to play around when I'm not sure if the results will work out! Maybe it would be useful to get some cheap makeup, because then I'll feel more free to just experiment. And if I can't tell the difference between cheap and expensive, I can return or sell the fancy Mac stuff and just stick with basics from Boots or Superdrug.

By the way, something about this comment led to me having a dream in which I was marrying you. By some dream logic this didn't interfere with our existing relationships with our husbands. Anyway it was much nicer than the nasty anxiety dreams I've been having about the wedding recently!

[iddewes]

I tend to think you should give the makeup away and get married with your bare face. Of course I say this as someone who also hardly ever wears makeup (although I do wear it now and then), but I think you should feel comfortable on your wedding day, and if it really distresses you that much wearing it, it's not a good idea.

[liv]

Thanks for the vote of support. I am definitely drawn towards this as an option, but I'm not sure if I'm just being a pathetic wimp or if it's actually the right decision!

[synecdochic]

Something to consider, perhaps, in making your decision calculus: If this is something that stressed you out to the point where you wished you could safeword out of the situation, would it be possible for you to continue with wearing make-up at the wedding itself without having residual stress/anxiety coming along with it? That is, completely aside from the question of whether you would want to wear makeup at the wedding starting from a neutral position, is the question itself now bringing enough stress/anxiety that it has become a meta-issue and a source of stress/anxiety itself?

As for the rest of it: I, personally, am not a fan of wearing makeup in everyday life despite years and years of theatre training meaning that I am very skilled in the application thereof, mostly because a) I hate the process of application and the amount of fussing it takes b) I hate having to be conscious of "yes, I have makeup on, I can't touch my eyes/face/etc without smudging it" -- both of these things together mean that I find wearing makeup to be stressful. Sarah wears makeup regularly because she enjoys the way it makes her look. When we hold The Wedding (we're already married but delaying the big huge ceremony so we can afford to throw a glorious destination-wedding party for tons of our friends), she will likely wear makeup, and I will likely not, just because those are our individual preferences.

Anybody who questioned that decision or thought that my wearing/not-wearing makeup affected their enjoyment of the party would ... not be the kind of person I would be interested in having at my party, honestly. I know you said you're not looking so much for reaffirmations of the right to wear/not-wear makeup or the statement that your wedding day is about you, but honestly, why the fuck do people care what you have or don't have on your face? I really don't see how your decision can or would affect somebody else's enjoyment of the party.

From what you've said here, it seems to me that the decision is stressing you, the experience you had with the "makeover" stressed the fuck out of you, the act of learning how to apply and wear the things you bought will stress you further, and wearing makeup you feel stressed and uncomfortable in on your wedding day will negatively affect your ability to enjoy yourself and feel natural/un-self-conscious on the day itself -- like you can't be yourself without worrying about smudging your makeup, and like the whole day will then become "oh God I can't laugh I'll get lipstick on my teeth", "oh god If I tear up I'm going to smudge my mascara/eyeshadow", etc. Wearing makeup, and working around it to preserve your authentic reactions without worrying about smudging the external appearance, really is a skill you have to grow practiced at over time, and from what you've said, the thought of practicing at that skill stresses you. I don't think the stress and anxiety is worth whatever amount of "goodwill" you'd be earning with your friends and guests by wearing makeup, especially since I think 95% of people attending won't even notice the difference. (Especially since good makeup application, especially for a morning event, is designed to be subtle and invisible!)

As for what you should do with the stuff you bought: if it's unopened, you can return it to the store for credit (which can be given/sold to a friend who's likely to use it) or refund. If it's opened, sadly, anything designed for use on eyes/lips should technically be thrown out, although if you have a friend whose colors are similar to yours and who's willing to accept the (very very mild) health risk in stuff that's been minimally used, you can give it away. (Sarah and I, for instance, share makeup whenever I actually bother to use any, and nothing bad has ever happened because of it. As long as you don't have an active eye infection or whatever, the risk really is very minimal.)

[liv]

Thank you for all these excellent points. You're right that even if my freakout wasn't directly caused by having makeup on my face, there will be meta-stress now. You've also suggested a whole bunch of new problems that I didn't even realize I needed to be anxious about! But in some ways that's comforting because it makes it seem like applying and wearing makeup is an actual high level skill, so I don't have to feel like a failure as an adult because I don't already know how to do it.

And it's a very useful thought that you can get away with a more understated look at a morning wedding. I definitely agree with you that it's ultimately up to me how I want to look. I don't quite have the confidence to say, screw social convention, I'll do whatever I like! I do care to some extent about having an outfit that looks intentionally put together rather than just a random mishmash. So if I do wear makeup, it will be to make me look better, not to please anyone else.

You're right that people won't really care what I choose, and indeed they don't have a right to care. It's not that my friends are so shallow they're unable to enjoy the event unless I follow convention appropriately, not at all. Just that when they are giving me helpful advice, I don't want to throw it back in their faces and say, well, who cares what you think, it's my wedding, I can do what I like!

[redbird]

I'd vote for not doing it at the wedding: you don't need that source of stress. (Whether you want to sell the stuff or give it away, or keep it to use bits for other occasions, I don't know.) You can have a fine silk dress and add any other bits that don't stress you: in my case that would most likely be fancy jewelry, and maybe a dressy hairstyle if we could find one that stayed up without giving me a headache.

If your wedding were in May of 2013, I might suggest trying the makeup a few times in advance, and seeing if you could get used to it. But not for this May, it would be extra work even if it didn't tangle with your self-image in these ways. (Ways I very much sympathize with: the last time I was laid off and job-hunting, a friend who took me clothing shopping also convinced me to at least buy some lipstick. I think I tried it once again, at home, and eventually tossed it.)

[liv]

I think you're probably right. I think I'd talked myself / let my friends talk me into the idea that putting on makeup is easy and I'm a pathetic failure as an adult if I can't do it. But I think it does actually take genuine skill and I don't have time to learn that skill between now and May. And I definitely feel better knowing I'm not the only person who finds makeup weird.

I would like to do a cool hairstyle, because I'm vain of my long thick hair and I think I could do something awesome with it. But I'm also a bit stressed about spending ages putting it up on the morning of the wedding, or making a do that would be in danger of falling apart during the day. I am thinking of braiding ribbons into it, or possibly even hair falls and coloured wool and feathers and stuff. And on the jewellery side I've been buying shinies in elisem's sale, so hopefully I will end up with something that works with the dress.

An additional thought

[redbird]

It sounds as though, no matter what, someone you care about will be disappointed in the choice, and that no matter what, that someone will not be jack. So, this isn't even "I can please hadassah and a bunch of other people, I should do it for them; it's a tradeoff between pleasing her and pleasing your mother. So throw that out of the calculation, and think in terms of how you'll feel.

[liv]

jack came up with a great metaphor about how I was trying to pick out a narrow path through a swamp, and I have one friend enthusiastically trying to drag me off to a better path in this direction, and another trying to pull me in the opposite direction, and all that will happen is I'll fall in the stinky swamp. So I pretty much have to refuse their help. Though Mum is being absolutely valiant about not trying to impose her ideas on the wedding, and let me do things my way even if my choices are different from hers.

[kaberett]

I am afraid I am very very low on brains, but strongly agree with everything everyone else has said, particularly the issue of "will this now be bringing meta-stress along".

Oh, no, wait, I am muttering gently to myself about what it means to look "better", but that's probably not very helpful.

Further point: a good photographer WILL be able to take photographs of you such that you don't look washed out: maybe one of the questions you want to ask is balancing wearing make-up on the day vs. touching up photographs later, if your concern is a record of the thing?

If you are feeling "this is not me" about the make-up, though, I strongly strongly lean towards don't.

[liv]

Thank you for this, it helps. You always seem to make excellently cogent points even when you start with disclaimers about your brain state. I had initially decided I wasn't going to bother with makeup and I'd take whatever came in the photos, but then hadassah convinced me that I would be spoiling my awesome amazing dress if my face doesn't live up to it.

As for looking better, I am not talking about that stupid thing where young, white, thin, symmetrical featured, hyper-gendered people are the greatest and everybody else is valued depending how close they can get to that ideal. No, I'm thinking that it's better to have an outfit that is appropriate for the situation, and reasonably coherent in terms of formality etc. Sure, it's possible to subvert these things, but I don't think I can pull that off, I'm not confident enough or artistic enough. So it's better for me to wear makeup with a very formal, very intense dress, not because I think I'm ugly without makeup, but because it will avoid a potentially weird mismatch. But that probably isn't a strong enough reason to deal with the meta-stress.

[mathcathy]

In the end, really only you can know what's right for you.

However, although make-up is never a stated necessity in life, I find that I need it for things like job interviews (if I don't wear it then it doesn't look like I've made an effort etc.)

Knowing how to apply it and having some which you know suits you around the house somewhere is a very good thing. I'd suggest that whatever you decide about the wedding, you keep the make-up. Practice with it a bit, maybe do bits of it and wear it to work between now and the wedding and see if you can get used to it. You know, foundation one day, eyes a different one.

Maybe you'll get compliments that will increase your confidence. Maybe it'll run and look awful after a couple of hours in the office and you'll know it will be a bother on the day.

[liv]

Yeah, I think you're right, whether or not I wear makeup at the wedding, a supply of good quality makeup in colours that work for me can't be a bad thing. I almost certainly should get into the habit of a small amount of makeup for job interviews and also major public lectures. I should have learnt those skills years ago, so this is probably a good excuse to start!

[ajnabieh]

The first time I wrote this comment, I tl;dr'd about makeup as a part of non-ordinary-time drag for me (my wedding, job interviews, etc etc), but you don't need that.

Practically: if you want to see how it would be to wear things on a daily basis, I'd start with lipstick. Lipstick is nigh-impossible to screw up, and you may have later occasions to wear it if you are considering ever wearing makeup. If putting on lipstick sets this off, then you know you need to stop. If it's OK, though, think about whether you want to go further. If you open the mascara, you won't be able to give it to someone else, so maybe do that one last. (I...also happen to think blush is pointless? But I have very pink cheeks naturally, and also I look like a vampire in my wedding photos so maybe you should not trust me on this.)

In any case--having to figure out what parts of a tradition that has massive quantity of fucked-up-ness attached to it you want to partake in sucks, and can often bring out the scary dysphoria moments. (All of mine around my wedding were around class and ability, not gender, but I feel you.) In the end, make the choice that will give you the least agita, if at all possible.

(And I agree with you about both the things you said you didn't need to hear, in case hearing that people agree with you on that is helpful in the least.)

[liv]

Thank you, this is really helpful and definitely makes me feel understood. It is a comfort me to think of this as drag, rather than something that should feel normal and natural to me and there's something wrong with me if it doesn't. I think I probably can wear lipstick without freaking, and I've often heard that lecture material is better retained if you have slightly darker than natural lips.

As far as I can gather, the thing with blusher is that it's there to compensate for the foundation... I have quite pink cheeks anyway, but if I go and cover them up with foundation, so they look smoother and less blotchy, I then have to wear blusher so that I don't look like a doll with the same skin tone all over my face. Which line of argument makes want to throw things, but that seems to be the way that makeup works! I would feel a lot less freaked about this wedding makeup option if I could wear subtle lipstick, mascara and maybe wild sparkly eyeshadow, but not bother with the concealer, foundation and blusher. But since the major argument in favour of makeup is to look better for the camera, it's foundation I need.

You totally don't look like a vampire! I would be delighted if my wedding photos came out that well, which is quite possibly an argument against makeup. And I think it probably is fairly traditional to freak out over some aspect of a wedding, because you're right, it is a really fucked up institution with loads of impossible expectations on brides. I suspect that the makeup was just the trigger, and I'm actually anxious about what it will do to people's view of me if I get married.

[ptc24]

I think, regardless of what make-up means, it can be quite a transformation, especially if you're not used to it.

Lots of people make a point about avoiding meta-stress, and that seems eminently wise to me.

[liv]

Yeah, fair enough. Some part of me thinks I ought to get used to it, because it will be helpful in my life if I can cope with the painted look. But it's almost certainly true that the wedding is the wrong time to be pushing my boundaries like that.

[ceb]

Pick-n-mix wedding: Absolutely, hands-down, the loveliest wedding I have ever been to was a pick-n-mix wedding. The bride and groom got to say exactly what they wanted and the whole thing was completely beautiful and very moving. I wish more people would do this! I am applauding your decision all the way.

Make-up: It ought to be your day, but it isn't completely, because you've invited all these people along and they have to be able to eat and sit down and get to the reception and so on. None of these things will be even slightly affected by whether you're wearing make-up (or what your dress looks like, or whether there are flowers, or how tall the cake is, or what colour the chairs are), so if it stresses you out or it doesn't feel like you, don't do it.

I've been to a number of weddings where the bride has so much make-up and hairdo that they don't really look like themselves any more, and it always makes me slightly sad.

[liv]

Thank you, this is really reassuring and just what I wanted to hear. I really appreciate that my friends aren't going to go around enforcing conventional expectations on me. So what I'm nervous about is a sort of nebulous "people" disapproving of me, not any specific individuals.

[aendr]

I don't know you well enough to contribute to commenting about your reactions or feelings, except in vague terms of wanting to be supportive and not knowing how.

For what it is worth, I wore a an absolutely dress up dress for my wedding. http://www.photonhunter.co.uk/photos/events/aegean-wedding/DSC_6598.jpg (Early Tudor). And absolutely no make up. I am not a make up person, and I didn't feel that the effort of trying to learn how to apply it and find makeup that didn't give me a skin reaction was worth it. I also didn't want a make up artist or hairdresser fussing around me on the day, because that would have made me uncomfortable.

Your wedding day is a day for you and jack and your loved ones to enjoy and to remember with fond memories. The run up is also a time to enjoy and remember with fond memories.

[liv]

I'm really glad I made this post now, it's prompted lots of people to share their awesome wedding photos! Your outfit is a really good counterargument to the view that you have to wear makeup to match a very fancy dress in an intense colour. If I look even a fraction as lovely as you, without having the hassle of doing makeup on the day, I'll be more than happy. Thank you, I did find this comment really supportive.

[pensnest]

If you can manage to figure out what will give you greater pleasure when you look through your wedding photos in years to come—show them to future friends, etc—it may help you to decide. I would guess, given what you've said in this post, that you would be happier going the no makeup route. It seems to be more *you*—of course, I don't know you very well. And friends worthy of the name won't make a big deal out of it, even if they would have liked to see you 'all done up'.

If you do decide to go with makeup, I think kass's suggestion would work—get a professional someone to apply it for you on the day, with a couple of practice runs beforehand. And think of it as stage makeup, worn for that aspect of your wedding which is a performance (ie the aspect that involves how you look, having your picture taken, that side of things). You can probably fund this by selling off the unopened Mac packages!

[liv]

I really don't have much opinion about the wedding photos, to be honest. I am hoping for photos that are sharp and in focus that will show our faces and outfits clearly. Beyond that I don't really care if I look a bit blotchy or otherwise less than perfect. I do definitely agree that the wedding is supposed to be at least partly a performance; if it weren't for that I would have just refused outright to even contemplate makeup. And thinking of it in those terms does help me to feel less panicky about the prospect.

The main reason I let myself be talked into makeup is to offset the dress; I have spent several years' clothes budget on this amazing Dress, and I don't want to spoil the effect because I'm a wimp about finishing off the outfit. I think that I'm kind of talking myself into eyeshadow, mascara and minimal lipstick, but not bothering with the foundation and blusher, since they're really only there for photos and that's the aspect that makes me feel most uncomfortable.

You're right that I could sell the makeup and hire an artist instead. When I was panicking over whether or not I should go ahead and spend silly money on the makeup, my friends said I could choose between buying the makeup, so that I'd have it to practice with and for other less OTT but still formal occasions, and hiring a makeup artist for the day. Because I was panicking at the time, and not thinking clearly, my instinct was that it was better to have my own cosmetics and not have to worry with dealing with a stranger on the morning of the wedding. Subconsciously I may have thought that it would be easier to back out if I merely buy stuff rather than hiring a person. But if I do definitely commit to doing the makeup thing, hiring someone might be less stressful as I wouldn't have to worry about my lack of skill!

[angelofthenorth]

From a purely style perspective, [personal profile] hadassah is absolutely right that if I wear an elegant silk dress, I really ought to wear fancy shoes and an elaborate hairstyle and jewellery and makeup, but in my mind I really want to have just the dress without needing to femme up in that way.

Now, see, this is where I disagree with Hadassah. Make up is not in the same class of stuff as the rest - you don't need an elaborate hairstyle, uncomfy shoes, jewellery and so on, not if you don't want to - a pretty clip, well-maintained hair, comfy shoes are fine. So, first of all, I would suggest separating out the make-up from the other baggage that you've lumped it in with, and see how that feels. You get to pick-n-mix on this too.

Having seen an idea of what this gorgeous dress is going to be like, I would say that make-up was a good idea, in part so you don't get lost in the dress. You've chosen a strong, vibrant colour in a design that has strong physical lines, that suits your personality, but will risk washing you out colour-wise without the make-up. I can't say for certain, because I've only seen the palette colours, but I'm basing on what she did and some subtle tweaks in the make-up would be easy enough to do. I can show you how to tweak what she did, so you get a similar result with a lot less faff - and a lot less skill :).

That said, it's not worth crying over, and I wouldn't want to force you into anything that makes you feel ill/upset in the way things seemed to. The make-up can be sold on quite easily - there are communities in LJ-land dedicated to MAC make-up and loos-adverts is also a place to sell such things. I'd certainly be tempted to buy some of it off you if you don't want it.

It's yours and Jacks wedding day, don't add to the stress by piling on additional baggage where you don't need to, but at the same time don't eschew something where a small amount of patience with yourself may give you a useful skill, and some insight into yourself.
Pick-n-mix is a good way to be, Just be careful that as with the ceremony that certain choices come with a small amount of baggage attached - thinking of some of the decisions that were made about the ceremony, for example.

I hope this is helpful. Much love
M

[liv]

Thank you, you've been incredibly helpful and supportive all through this little crisis! I think I will bring the makeup when I come to visit and we can play around. And I want to talk to you about hair, too.

You're quite right that I can separate out different aspects of the outfit, the dress doesn't commit me to evil shoes and the makeup doesn't commit me to an OTT hairstyle. It's helpful to be reminded of that. I'm thinking more and more that I do want the cool eyeshadow, but I don't really want the foundation and blusher and all that mask stuff, so advice on selling it makes me feel less trapped.

[karen2205]

[am tired, so hope this makes sense]

I'm wondering how much of you being so upset(?)/meltdown-y over the session with the make up artist was to do with the make up itself and it being wholly unfamiliar to you and how much was around the session being something you were meant to be enjoying, but weren't & where your friends weren't providing you with the right sort of support (am not suggesting they were at fault here, only that what they were doing wasn't right for you at that time).

I think if you being upset and anxious is more down to the latter, then it might be worthwhile trying out some make up by yourself/with friends who are able to be the right sort of supportive and see how the make up looks/feels to you, without the added pressure(?) of that particular session, and then making the decision about whether to wear any make up at the wedding at a later date.

If your upset/stress/anxiety is more down to wearing make up itself and it not feeling like you and so on, then I don't think your wedding is a sensible place to try to challenge your current internal viewpoint, because it will make the whole day very stressful for you. I understand what you mean about it being a public event, but any possible benefit to other people (eugh, my feminist buttons don't like this concept!) of you wearing make up is marginal compared with the enormous impact on you of doing it.

I have make up that is perfectly good that's many years old. Much of it comes with labels saying use within 12/24/36 months, but I don't take them too seriously. If it remains the same consistency and looks OK, I'm happy to carry on using it. I'd probably be more cautious about lending it someone else, but I don't think I've lent anyone make up for many years, so it's not really relevant.

[liv]

Mm, this is characteristically astute, thank you! I think it was a lot more the situation than the makeup itself. That's why I am contemplating trying out the makeup in less fraught situations to see if it's ok for the wedding. Thanks for the practical advice about keeping makeup, too.

I don't want to offend any feminist principles, definitely. I don't think that wearing makeup benefits other people, exactly, I think that accepting a gift from my generous friends benefits them, whereas turning it down would be rude and hurtful.

[forestofglory]

Ok so this might sound kinda dippy, but for my wedding I want R and I to both look like ourselves. I feel it's important to make that commitment as my authentic self. So I don't want to dress up as pirate or a character for a story, or wear a white dress (I hate wearing white) or uncomfy shoes. I doubt I will wear make-up.

Like you I don't wear make-up normally and don't know how to put it on. I don't think not wearing make-up is central to my sense of self, but it is a lot of bother to learn how to wear it, and I don't think I'm up for learning right now. I do think it is skill I might like to learn someday.

[liv]

I think the ship has rather sailed on looking like myself, given that I'm going to be wearing a corset that gives me a startling hourglass figure. I am definitely with you on no white and no uncomfortable shoes, mind you!

I think that this close to the wedding is probably the wrong time to try picking up a new skill, especially one that feeds into my insecurities so much. But I may be able to get round this by having friends helping me, or possibly even employing a pro on the day.